Friday, September 8, 2017

grammar - Can ~たり~たり end with verbs other than する?


In the past, I have come across several examples of ~たり~たり seemingly being used with other final verbs than する, which is generally taught to be mandatory at the end of ~たり~たり phrases.


Is this grammatically acceptable?


Here are some example phrases from some quick googling:



  • 立ったり座ったり働く


  • 話したり笑ったり食べる


Also, these seem to be describing that final verb. They could be rephrased (as I understand them) as Vながら~たり~たりする, or something to that effect. Am I understanding this correctly?


Edit #1


As @snailboat pointed out in chat, my interpretation of these can also be rephrased as:



  • 立ったり座ったりして働く

  • 話したり笑ったりして食べる


Is this what those mean? Or are they, for example, 立ったり座ったり働いたりする?



My feeling is that they mean the former. However, one example I found which I feel could go either way is 「のんびりしたりうろついたり食べるのが好きです」. I'm not really sure how to interpret that one.


Edit #2


Can this also be done with adjectives? I have come across several examples:



  • 可愛かったり美しい

  • ダルかったりキツい日



Answer



Both interpretations are entirely possible, depending on which part you decide was omitted:





  1. Aたり / Bたり(するなど) / C


    Doing C, such as doing A and such as doing B.


    (The 〜するなど here can also be 〜するとか, 〜するなんて, or more broadly, 〜して)




  2. Aたり / Bたり / C(たりする)


    Doing things such as A, such as B, and such as C.





Possibility #1 may seem more “grammatically acceptable” to you, as you may already be familiar with other instances of this kind of omission:



  • 立ったり 座ったり(して) 何してるの?

  • 眠いのかな。あくびしたり 黙ったり(して)。

  • 走ったり 飛んだり(して) 疲れるわ。

  • 仕事を探したり お金を借りたり(して) どうにか暮らすよ。

  • ふざけた顔をしたり(して) 面白い人だ。


Possibility #2 fares worse in terms of “grammatical acceptability”, but my notion is that certain liberties are taken with lists. I believe in English you are taught to prefix the final item of a list with “and/or”, but don’t you see them omitted quite often? Sometimes the “and/or” is unnecessary because the sentence ends there. And even when there's a clause after it, don't you usually grok where the list ends, or at least get the gist?




  • I do things like lie down, read, (or) chill out — simple things.

  • The moon was shining, shimmering, (and) splendid.

  • He could be running, walking, (or) listening to music, and he enjoyed every minute of it.

  • She asked, begged, (and) pleaded, but for what good?


When you omit the final 〜たりする, sentences can be much shorter while still getting the overall point across. This omission is becoming quite common, even in newscasts, but technically it is incorrect and frowned upon by authoritative institutions (source). Don’t do it on a grammar test.



  • 踊ったり しゃべったり 本を読んだりすることが好き ← So correct and yet so wordy

  • 踊ったり しゃべったり 本を読んだりするのが好き

  • 踊ったり しゃべったり 本を読むのが好き ← Shorter



More examples of this type of omission:



  • 寝る前はTV見たり、歯磨いたり、日記を書く。

  • 夏休みは海に行ったり、山に行ったり、里に行った。

  • 部屋を片付けたり、シャワーを浴びたり、服を選んでたら遅れちゃった。

  • 熱が出てたり、頭が痛かったり、のどが腫れてるので風邪だと思う。


No comments:

Post a Comment

periodic trends - Comparing radii in lithium, beryllium, magnesium, aluminium and sodium ions

Apparently the of last four, $\ce{Mg^2+}$ is closest in radius to $\ce{Li+}$. Is this true, and if so, why would a whole larger shell ($\ce{...